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Old 06-24-2006, 07:30 PM   #16
matimus
 
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fuck sorry bout the dbl post

Last edited by matimus; 06-24-2006 at 07:35 PM..
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Old 06-24-2006, 07:31 PM   #17
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heres the parts you will need. they sell packages with ALL the right parts. By far the best way to go.
http://www.zionsvilleautosport.com/s...egory_Code=CKE
I suggest gettin kits 2,3,5, and mabey 6
i beleive they sell the parts individually if you'd like that.
make sure when you get the engine that the give you both of the engine to car connectors.(female and male) That makes about a two to three hour differense in the wiring and it enable you to use the m50 wire loom so you dont have to cut it up.

and yes i will still help you
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Old 06-24-2006, 08:02 PM   #18
d.maczko

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hmmmmm but i can get all this stuff out of the 325, i know i have to get the 5 series oil pan and pick up, also i can get the e36 rad and hoses, and ill probably pick up an electric fan. also ill get the complete harness male and female, also the exhaust i can get

ive heard most of this stuff will bolt in.

also i know i need to get the 320i brake booster i think?

let me know
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Old 06-25-2006, 07:10 AM   #19
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Yea as redrocket suggested check out e30tech there are a lot of people there who have done swaps and they would probably be able to tell you all you need to know.
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Old 06-25-2006, 11:46 AM   #20
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OK listen, there are to many factors to deal with and it is very dependent on what swap you are doing.
First you dont need an e36 rad the e30 one willl work just fine you just need the e36 hoses, I use an aluminum e30 rad. The e30 rad give more clearance. I ditched the clutch fan and went with a dual stage S-blade electric fan setup as a pusher. My supercharged S50 never overheats.

Quote:
also the exhaust i can get
Thats all fine and dandy but it wont work. The stock exhuast manifold needs to be modified to clear the swaybar, then the rest has to be modified to fit aswell. It doesn't just bolt on.

Quote:
also i know i need to get the 320i brake booster i think?
Yes you do, but that also needs to be modified. you need to cut the shaft of of your stock one and precisely weld it on to the 320i booster. NOT easy!

And depending on what tranny you go with you will have to get a new driveshaft. If you use the original e30 tranny you can use the e30 driveshaft but you will have to get a custom tranny brace made for you. If you use the e36 tranny you can use the e30 tranny brace but you will need a new, shorter driveshaft.
Also If you use the e3o tranny you can use the e30 flywheel,clutch and starter but if you use the e36 tranny you need the e36 flywheel,clutch, and starter, or you can switch the ring gear from the e36 starter to your e30 starter and use that.


Also I beleive you car being an 86 you need the coolant reservoir tank from the 325's with all the hoses.

You will also need the e34 5series oilpan and dipstick tube, the proper throttle cable (e36 I think), Modified power steering hoses to connect the e36 pump to the e30 rack. Gaskets, Spacers, oil level sensor(e34), E34 M5 offset engine mounts.

While you have the engine out you should also replace:
-water pump -> upgrade to the metal empeller pump
-T-stat housing -> upgrade to metal one
-lower temp t-stat
-New clutch, pilot bearing, resurfaced(mabey lightened) flywheel
-new reverse light sensor
Also get:
-e36 O2 sensor

Make sure the send the alternator, power steering pump, MAF sensor, ecu, and wire harness from the same car. Most wreckers like to give you a miss matched heap of crap.
I have a e36 325 ecu and maf sensor cause this happened to me with my engine.

I raised shit for two week untill the finally tracked down all the right parts for my m3 engine. so i kept the wrong ones. HAHA.
as you can see there is more to it than just buying some parts and bolting it all together.
I strongly suggest getting the parts from zionsville. They know all about this kind of swap and have all the right parts for it. Most you can buy already modified. If you do it this way then yes, you can just bolt it all together and go.

I may have forgot something but if I remember I will post .
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Old 06-25-2006, 01:16 PM   #21
d.maczko

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holy wow, this project has a mind of its own. im not sure what would be more cost effective now that i think about it, i first planned on having 2 choices, swap an m50 in or rebuild my m20 and boost it. The reason i was planning on m50 swap was because of how it just 'bolts' in, well so ive heard, now i am clearly wrong. So now i have a question for you guys, what would be more cost effective, still swap the m50 or pull the m20, rebuild, boost it.
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Old 06-25-2006, 07:04 PM   #22
matimus
 
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well it depends on what "cost effective" means to you.

To me "cost effective" means the most reliable power for the buck. That would be the M20 built with boost. IMO. they are inexpensive to rebuilt and maintain. Even when rebuilt to stock specs they can handle significant boost levels with no problem. stock CR is 8.1:1 and I've seen M20's with 18-20 psi running on 91octane put out over 300 at the wheels, all while retaining some levels of relability and drivability. Then theres option 2: rebuild you M20 to a 3.0l stroker which has performance similar to an S50 then boost that.

It all depends what you want to spend. I could have rebuilt and boosted my old M20 for less than half of what it cost to do the Supercharged S50 swap, but I was going for originality and individuality. Not best bang for your buck.

All said and done a stock M20 rebuild should run somewhere around $2-$2500 and then a good FI setup would add another $2500 but you'd be over 300 crank hp for sure depending how hard you want to push it, 400hp IS possible.

As for an S50 swap, Bare minimum, with a high milaege engine would run around $5-5500. A low milaege engine swap would be closer to $7500. Then another $5000 for a supercharger and your up to about 360-370hp

A high milaege M50 swap can be done properly for about 3000.
But just remember after that $3000 you still only have mabey 200hp and over 150,000 kms, sometimes more. it will still need to rebuilt somewhere in the near future.

IMO. if you dont want to spend too much but still have some pony's to play with I'd go with the boosted M20. that way you basically got a brand new engine with no kms on it. and you wont have to worry about break downs.

Thats just my two cents,
good luck with your choices
costs are all in CAN currency

Thanks
Mat
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Old 06-25-2006, 08:20 PM   #23
d.maczko

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hmmmm mat you do make some damn good points,
anywhere in town that i could take my m20 to and get it rebuilt that i wouldnt be worried about blowing up after, lol.

damn my mind was so made up on the m50 but now that you've laid it out for me.

i will have to think about this over the next week as im out of town and ill research like a mad man, ill be on periodically from now and then.


damn man, youve opened my eyes
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Old 06-25-2006, 10:36 PM   #24
matimus
 
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Go to EC auto on 118 aveand about 89st. (477-1088)
they do great work and theres an old guy there (iforget his name) he used to race Bmw's like e21's,e30, and 2002's and he knows his stuff.
check out the stroker kit from IE. I bought several things from them for my old m20 and they know there shit and are very easy to do business with. click on e30 engine for the stroker kits.
https://secure3.nexternal.com/shared.../products.asp?

I dont recomend the 3.2l kit if you plan on boosting it becausethe amount that you need to bore the cylinders to get that 3.2l's really makes the cylinder walls very thin and prone to failure under boost. NA its fine but not boosted. Feel free to give them a call, ask for Jeff, tell him what you are looking for and he will help you out.

BTW i'm not saying the M50 swap is bad. Im just saying that for the money you could build a 3.0l stroker M20 and have a new engine with more power for about the same $$$

Let me know if you want more info on any of the subjects discused so far, ill help you out. I did about 8-9 months of research on all of these options before i decided to go with the S50 so i can help you.

thanks
mat
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Old 06-25-2006, 10:41 PM   #25
matimus
 
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Shit I think that was a bad link.I checked it after and it didn't work.

try this one.
click on e30 performance on the left hand sidehttp://www.bmw2002.com/
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Old 06-25-2006, 11:41 PM   #26
d.maczko

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wow thanks matt, the 3.0L kit seems like a good kit. not a bad price either. EC auto does engine rebuilds? but do they do boring and honing? how much do you figure for an engine rebuild? time frame?
hmmmm i see that it says that you use an 'i' motor, but would it work with an 'e' motor with an 'i' head. because i read somewhere the blocks are the same minus the head? correct me if thats wrong.

I'll definitly be researching this more this week.

thanks for all the info matt. much appreciated
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Old 06-26-2006, 07:08 AM   #27
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they do everything there . its a machine shop.
Thats where i got my s50 heads ported and my flywheel lightened and resurfaced. they do great work. give them a call and ask some questions
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Old 06-26-2006, 02:39 PM   #28
d.maczko

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alright i was about to call EC auto and get some quotes but im not sure what i am essentially asking for here, i know to ask for a rebuild, but what about the head? port and polish, valve job, etc. not sure what to do about that.

also this is an 'e' motor so ill probably have to find an 'i' head to get it breathing properly. now ive been giving great thought to this path of rebuilding the m20 and boosting it over the course of fall and winter. and im almost positive id like to go with this route, it seems like a building process for me as i start with a stock motor and build it up.

I've done some research around the forums and have noticed some guys making nice power with a stock m20 boosted. such as a32guy on e30tech, this sounds like the route i would like to go. 324whp @ 14psi sounds perfect for me. I know it will cost quite a bit but it will be a progressive project, buy as i go or find.

so first i guess i should find an 'i' head possibly?
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Old 06-26-2006, 09:38 PM   #29
d.maczko

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ok guys im looking for an 'i' head, it'll be rebuilt but i need all the pieces. so let me know

i may have found my turbo, either the HX40 or the H1E which one is for sale on e30tech

hmmmmmmm still researching though

and im not sure if i should rebuild the motor or get some shop to do it, ive done 4 motors before but never a bmw motor and i still need a place to put the rolling chassis after the motor is pulled and rebuilt. any suggestions on that one guys? as in someone with a garage with a stall they wouldnt mind renting out for cheap hehe


thanks guys,

Dill
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Old 06-27-2006, 11:13 AM   #30
d.maczko

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it seems that the m20b25 is the better motor to boost, so i guess im in the search for an m20b25 with decent kms on it so i can rebuild it to oem specs.

so if ya'll know someone with one let me know
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