mmmm brakes - Page 2 - United Bimmer Community

**bitcore** · 11-15-2005, 09:02 PM

Ok, It's official.... Axxis ultimate pads suck something awful compared to Hawk HPS's and even OEM... NO WONDER they were significantly cheaper.

I only changed my rotors (OEM, non-drilled\slotted, vented fronts & solid rears) all around and put on the Axxis Ultimate pads. I did not do anything else to the car, so my judgment of their performance shouldn't be affected by any other variables. If anything, the new rotors should make them work better than when I had the HPS pads - in which case I re-used my old rear rotors. I used liberal amounts of brake cleaner and kept the glue on the BACK of the pads. I'll flush my fluid sometime soon, hopefully that will make these shitty pads bearable. I've let them brake in for quite a while, I've driven about 600 highway miles on them, about 350 regular street miles, and about 50 aggressive, "track level" miles on them. Break-in is at *least* 95% done, and hasn't gotten any better in the past week.... I'll definitely update in a while if anything changes

Well, they are quiet and stop the car, but, the braking force is NOWHERE NEAR as linear as OEM or the HPS pads. Pedal feel is really weird. It's almost unpredictable the way they respond according to speed\pedal force and I really can't figure out the curve of speed\vs pedal force. So, every time I brake, I have to adjust my braking force on the fly. It's terrible. My lines\fluid should be perfectly fine since it's braking evenly from caliper to caliper and was working great with my HPS pads although I had a warped front left rotor. Braking with the warped rotor & HPS pads was actually BETTER than the AXXIS Ultimate's if you discount the vibration...

You know what else, They fade like hell. The fade isn't as bad as when the OEM pads or HPS pads faded, but it DOES change that "curve" I was talking about. It has the characteristic of less braking force once everything all gets hot, so it is fade, but it makes the braking force required more linear and "normal" compared to when they aren't hot. It's really fscked up and downright un-f**king-safe... It's like they are track pads and need to be at a higher operating temp, but they have already began to fade at that temperature! Not only are the fade characteristics weird, but they fade MUCH sooner than OEM or the Hawk HPS pads! These are suppose to be for performance street\track pads!
**EDIT: I meant to say they DO fade much sooner than the HPS pads, and at about the same time (if not sooner, like I said) than OEM pads.

Well, they don't make much noise, except when I brake hard in reverse in which case the front pads make this really weird chatter noise & feeling on occasion... so the noise level is a plus... woo.... but if your concerned about noise, get the OEMs cause performance pads are going to squeak unless you have some really nice calipers (brass bushings, etc) and some serious glue on the back of the pads.

As for dust, can't really comment on that as I haven't washed my car in a while... they are ceramic so they should dust a bit less but it looks like they are just as bad as OEM pads.... which is pretty bad.

To be honest, I am VERY tempted to buy some EBC Green Stuff or even go back to my current favorite of the three that I've tried: Hawk HPS's. Seriously, They suck that badly. I'll gladly throw this $100+ set of pads out the window if they keep working like this.

So far, I've had first hand experience of (IE: installed and used all the way): 2 sets of OEM pads, 1 set of Hawk HPS with new front OEM rotors (old rear rotors), and 1 set of AXXIS Ultimates with new OEM rotors all around (that's right, I replaced my front 2 rotors after using one set of pads on them, front left was warped to shit)
When I say set, I replaced all 8 pads at once.

OEM's: Quiet, linear feeling, fades a little soon for serious track use, predictable, but dusts like fuck. Good cheep pad.

Hawk HPS: Excellent street\aggressive\track pad. Less dusty than OEM, but still dusty. They can squeak like hell once you heat them up unless you glue the piss out of them and possibly get brass caliper bushings. -Very similar feeling to OEM, but lasts much longer and bites much harder. WELL worth the money

AXXIS Ulitimates: Shit. All the things you don't want in a brake pad except they are quiet when the rotors are spinning forward.... and um..... well, they do manage to stop the car... I'd buy em if I was a crackhead who had a bmw, but only if a full set could be had for $5...

**komodo** · 11-15-2005, 09:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bitcore

Ok, It's official.... Axxis ultimate pads suck something awful compaired to Hawk HPS's...

nick_318is · 11-15-2005, 09:07 PM

when the spring come around i'm planning on putting on some Hawk HPS pads.

**xsperf** · 11-15-2005, 09:08 PM

where did you make that conclusion, bitcore.. ive tried one, but not both.. really wanted to know though, and how about EBC green/red stuff?

oh aha, i just realized that you probably bought them and put them on and they sucked

**bitcore** · 11-15-2005, 09:26 PM

NOTE: check my post again, I was in the process of writing my conclusion when I accidentally hit submit.

**xsperf** · 11-15-2005, 09:46 PM

wow i disagree. i didnt have nearly as bad as a result.. worse than OEM? not with me, are you sure you installed the correctly? are you sure yours wasnt a defect? let me just say, that the combination ive tried was zimmerman x-drilled rotors with these pads, no stainless brake lines or anything,a nd it was AMAZING, no veering, very little wear, great stopping power, little dust, no noise

**94bmw325i** · 11-15-2005, 09:47 PM

Did you get cross drilled rotors? next wednesday im putting on cross drilled rotors and axxis ultimate pads, and that cool blue brake fluid.

**bitcore** · 11-15-2005, 09:58 PM

No. OEM everything except I used AXXIS Ultimate pads. I did not bleed lines or change anything else so I could judge the difference between the hawk hps and the axxis ultiamtes pads as accuritely as I could. I did install them correctly, otherwise I wouldn't be stopping now would I? It's difficult to minorly fuck up a brake job and just have them work a little werid aside from not cleaning the rotor surface or getting some weird chemcial on the pad\rotor, which would eventually grind off after a few hundred miles of street driving anyways, esp. if it was on the pad. (which I did not do, and used liberal amounts of 3M brake cleaner)
I made sure not to glaze the pad either. Once I noticed any sort of fade, I took lots of cool-down driving time, esp. before stopping for over 60 seconds. (and if I had to, IE: at a stop light, I rolled forward a couple feet to ensure not one part of the rotor was trapped beween the pads when they were hot)

Don't change as many variables such as non standard rotors, SS lines or new fluid and you can see how different the pads are from each other. I do have the blue fluid, have yet to do that.

**komodo** · 11-15-2005, 10:02 PM

Hm, that's a nice write up.

If you rework it a bit and organize it in an article format, I'll add it to the knowledge base for others to read before they buy new brake pads.

**bitcore** · 11-15-2005, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by komodo

Hm, that's a nice write up.

If you rework it a bit and organize it in an article format, I'll add it to the knowledge base for others to read before they buy new brake pads.

The origional thread should be left intact though, to provide counter points with the other people who have enjoyed the pads.
We'll see how it goes, esp. if they suck so bad and I try the EBC green stuff or just go back to some hawk HPS's

**komodo** · 11-15-2005, 10:06 PM

Yep, try to keep the article as unbiased as possible though, mostly reporting it as it is. Ya know? Less opinions, more facts.

**xsperf** · 11-15-2005, 11:15 PM

thats interesting bitcore.. but the point is i got different results.. whatever though, wish ya luck with ur EBC if ur gonna get em

**///M Power** · 11-16-2005, 03:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by komodo

However it gets kind of annoying... they squeak pretty bad because the sound deadening material was removed to improve the braking ability. So you can be pulling up slowly to a stop sign with all kinds of girls around and your car screeches.

Did you forget to put on that anti-squeal gooey shit?

**///M Power** · 11-16-2005, 03:28 AM

How long have you had these pads on when you wrote that write up? That's so weird. I had Ultimates on my e34 and they were amazing. And now I have them on my M3 and they are still performing great. In all honesty I think you either got some sort of defective product or there is already soemthign wrong with your brakign system possibly amplified by the fact that it took you so long to correct your warped rotor.

**brien4787** · 11-16-2005, 05:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xsperf

wow i disagree. i didnt have nearly as bad as a result.. worse than OEM? not with me, are you sure you installed the correctly? are you sure yours wasnt a defect? let me just say, that the combination ive tried was zimmerman x-drilled rotors with these pads, no stainless brake lines or anything,a nd it was AMAZING, no veering, very little wear, great stopping power, little dust, no noise

How the hell does someone go about installing brake pads incorrectly?